What I was suggesting that program for is this: If, when using that program, you can get the phone to show up as an 8gb removable drive (USB Mass Storage type) and successfully read/write to it, up to at least 65-80% of its full capacity (I think someone said one of those numbers on here before), then I think that would show that the hardware can support the card, and all that is needed for it to fully work is a proper driver file. I've never programmed anything useful, much less a driver file, and these ideas are chock full of assumptions, but I think it would work. That's all I was suggesting the program for, though. No crazy compression schemes or any of that hoo-ha.

The "white switch" you're talking about IS the write protect tab. The SD card I had came from ebay, for a pretty low price at the time, and I suppose you get what you pay for. I kept getting errors that the card was write-protected, and I had the switch in the correct position, so I looked on forums for advice on how to make it writable. Folks suggested that the write -protect tab could slide around, which keeps you from knowing exactly if its locked or not at the time, or it could just plain break and not be representative of the true state at all. I read somewhere that you could just take the tab out to fix this, so thats what I tried. Too bad I found out afterwards that I could have just put tape over the tab and made it permanently writable. Oh well. I need another SD card now.

About your card splitting open, I'd check into the warranty first, then consider superglue if they dont cover it. Not sure where to apply it, though.

I think I continue to read this thread just to punish myself.

*We're not going to get a camera in this phone
*We're not going to get EVDO rev a on this phone
*We're not going to get WM6 on this phone
*We're not going to get SDHC on this phone

*We're not going to get a camera in this phone

-Most definitely not, with the device being out two years, it's not going to happen.

*We're not going to get EVDO rev a on this phone

-You are correct as it's totally different hardware, and unless you can get the chip, your soldering skills are amazing, and you can hack in the drivers, it's not going to happen.

*We're not going to get WM6 on this phone

All signs point to NO, and the likely hood of this happening is less than getting hit by lightening while getting your 20 million lottery check.

*We're not going to get SDHC on this phone

I highly doubt this will happen as I have been told it's hardware based and not software...


This is my attempt at very dry humor, although since I have had a lack of sleep, it's funny to me, but to you it's probably just going to be stupid. Man I need to take a nap, and it's only 10 AM...

__________________
-Michael
Need help setting up your i730/i830 or other WM2003/WM5 Phone, as well as the other hacks I have done, check out the MRailing Guides and Links

Michael, sorry I should have been more clear in my last post. I was attempting to list the stuff that people have continued insist on asking about even when they've been repeatedly informed that it just isn't going to happen. This thread is a good example of people not listening to the knowledgeable advice that has been given to them and continue to beat a dead horse. It makes me want to cry sometimes.

I got what you were doing, I was agreeing, and trying to add to it, trying to beat the dead horse...

__________________
-Michael
Need help setting up your i730/i830 or other WM2003/WM5 Phone, as well as the other hacks I have done, check out the MRailing Guides and Links

Haha, the first time I read it it just passed by me. Took me two times. Man I need sleep myself..

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I fully realize that I personally am beating a dead horse. My take on the matter is: I've got a great device (even better after implementing MRailing's hacks and advice). I still tell folks that it's the best made PDA phone I've encountered. The chance of SDHC support isn't even practical to think about, considering it's age. Same thing for getting some of these other things to work. However, the Intel PXA27x family of processors are very well documented, and should be pretty easy to tweak (this I got from a conversation with the guy who got Linux running on the Treo 680p), and the SD Folks put out some good documentation (read that where someone had already hacked SDHC support for their previously "unsupported" device). An XDA owener hacked WM6 to work on his device (google it). SCH-i730's are getting cheaper, as are books on progamming for WinCE. What I'm babbling about, is: it probably won't happen (undeniably screwed on the camera thing), but I'm sure the same was said about getting tethering and WM5 on the i730. "Necessity's the mother of invention", and all that crap.

What I suggest: close the thread. There's no real news here, and anyone looking for an update can contact another member in a private message. If any of these issues gets some miraculous solution, you can be sure that the person who creates/discovers it won't keep it a secret. If the time comes when you find another great "super-pda phone", get it and leave the i730 behind. If any new solutions do arise, though, you'll be able to get more use out of the i730, or get another one, with some newer features unveiled, for a lower and lower price.

Actually it wasn't said about tethering or WM5. We knew those weren't hardware limitations from the start. It was said that this was a hardware limitation, but of course, Samsung has been wrong in the past, and it just takes one person to create an application that bypasses what's wrong. My warnings in this thread have been not to waste money on the device thinking it's going to work, or expecting it to work. I don't like to see people waste money on something when they could spend that money on something more useful (like two 4GB SD cards that we KNOW do work).

There isn't a reason to close the thread, as this is really the only discussion on 8GB cards, and if someone does figure something out, then it's a place to post, once people quit posting, this threads slides down to depths of searchood, and it's another great discussion.

__________________
-Michael
Need help setting up your i730/i830 or other WM2003/WM5 Phone, as well as the other hacks I have done, check out the MRailing Guides and Links

I think you make some great points, and I agree with you. I just don't consider it wasting money, because even a failed attempt can be thoroughly documented to make it easy for the next guy to attempt (and the non-working cards can be resold on ebay). Besides, the guy who attempts the mod will learn a lot from his research and may end up using that knowledge to help build that next killer device.

I just noticed that I'm really not saying this for any good reason. Your point was directed, I believe, at the end user who won't be tweaking the phone himself, and will waste time and money hoping that someone else can find the solution. That, I totally agree with. This probably sounds hypocritical coming from someone who has 2 8gb SD cards in the mail, but I'm also going to order a CE programming book or 2 and go learn some stuff.

My son was born blind and sick. If there wasn't people always praying and hoping and searching out ways/technologies to find out how they can better maneuver in this world, ie the Blind Now being Able to See Through Their Tongue as one example there would be no advances.

Likewise in regards to other things, like technologies that help organizationally challenged people like myself to get around better, I think it's easy to dismiss stuff, based on conventional wisdom, but I don't try to do that..unless it's an out and out contradiction. You do bring up really good points, so I do take that into consideration. With all my questions and comments, I may come off as annoying, or ignorant, so I apologize for that..though I'd like to think of myself as more so curious, persistent, and inquisitive, I probably can be the other things also at times

Either way, while I don't have much faith in these companies, and don't expect much from them, there are a lot of people in the world, who, Lord Willing, can find ways around things. So in regards to Secure Digital technology, and the SDHC benefit that most i730s are missing, I'm glad you are keeping the thread open. Thanks. BTW you both have good points to consider.

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Man...wait a sec...Why is it the SD Cards Techmillion, and others bought from fastmemoryman on ebay and elsewhere look generic, BUT the ones on this site look more official and have the Samsung brand name on them as you see here..??

http://www.flash-memory-store.com/sa...gital-8gb.html

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Gents, This is a response taken from the Samsung FAQ site for the i730. If it has been posted before, my apologies.

--------------

What is the Maximum SD Card Capacity That Is Supported For Use On The I730?

While the Operating System and hardware will support up to a 4GB SD Card, we recommend nothing larger than a 1GB SD Card. Using cards over 1GB may sometimes cause a slower than normal response time when accessing data on the card.

-------------

Yes, that is what the last couple of pages of discussion have been doing. 1GB, 2GB, and NON-SDHC 4GB cards do work in the i730. I have MANY 1GB cards, a 3x 2GB cards, and 2x 4GB cards, and all of them work without issue in the i730.

Currently I am using a 2GB card in my i730 to hold my files, and I have my 4GB cards moved to my camera.

I have never heard about anyone having issues with 2GB cards, except for some possibly corruption, but that was fixed with WM5. 4GB cards are on the fence, some will work, some don't. You need to make sure it doesn't say SDHC on it. I have two AData 4GB cards, and both will work, but I don't need the space at the present time, so I just use them in my camera.

If you aren't on WM5 yet, there can be issues with cards over 1GB, and it all came down to possible corruption of the data on the card. Namely it would make everything vanish. Sometimes it would show up fine in Windows, but not on the phone, and copying the files off the card, and back on it would fix it. With WM5, I haven't had any issues, or heard of any issues with cards loosing data like it did with WM2003.

If you are looking for a new card, your best bet is to stick with 2 GB cards (normally found around $20-25, possibly cheaper). Sure it would be nice to have 8GB, but it isn't possible, as you can read above.

__________________
-Michael
Need help setting up your i730/i830 or other WM2003/WM5 Phone, as well as the other hacks I have done, check out the MRailing Guides and Links

Just curious to know if you or anyone else knows if it's possible to format a FAT32 SDHC 8GB (or any SDHC) card from FAT32 to NTSC, and if so is there any significance to being able to do that to go on and partition it from there say into two 4GB partitions? I'm expecting the answer is no, just I may learn something new in the process. Thanks.

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There is no such thing as NTSC format. NTSC is the standard in which analog television signals are broadcast in the US, Canada, Japan, South Korea, the Philippines, and Mexico. Other parts of the world use a format of analog TV called PAL. In 2009 NTSC broadcasts will no longer be around in the US, as we are switching to a digital system.

I think what you meant was NTFS, or NT File System (New Technology File System), which is a type of file system that was introduced for improved file protection and performance. NTFS stores additional information in a metadata area of the file which includes the name, permissions, etc.

The real difference between NTFS and FAT32(FAT) is that NTFS includes additional information for file security. The one thing that you would run in to if you were able to get your card formatted to NTFS, is that your i730 wouldn't read it, since it can't read NTFS partitions in the card reader. There is also no reason to do an NTFS partition on an SD card. FAT32 is capable of up to 2TB drives (Yet most Microsoft OS's only support 32GB partitions).

FAT32 is capable of multiple partitions. In Windows, you can't use the Windows Formatter to format the SD card to multiple partitions, but you can use a third party tool to format an SD card. The problem is, the SD slot won't read the other partitions on the card, and you will only see the first partition on the card, IF, it will even read a SDHC card.

So what you are talking about is creating multiple partitions, NOT needing to change the file system of the device. But the BIG problem is the SDHC and the way the card is designed, not in the partitions...

__________________
-Michael
Need help setting up your i730/i830 or other WM2003/WM5 Phone, as well as the other hacks I have done, check out the MRailing Guides and Links

I think this needs to be a the very top of the most read sticky, or maybe all the stickeys

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I just wanted to toss this in there for people:

The old SD cards use byte access (1 byte access per internal storage system) while SDHC cards use sector access (512 bytes per internal storage point, like a hard disk uses).

The limit of the address systems is that there can only be 4,294,967,296 access points (which is why there is a 4GB limit on SD (4,294,967,296 points * 1 byte/point = 4GB) and 2TB limit on SDHC (4,294,967,296 points * 512 bytes/sector = 2TB))...

This means that in order to get an SD card slot to fully read an SDHC card of 8GB you would have to change the hardware access size of the SD card to 2 bytes per internal data point (i.e. ask for 2 bytes at a time, rather than 1). This is theoretically possible, but you'd have to rewrite the software in the control circuitry and break compliance with the SD1.0 standards.

Now, I've run into cases before where I've had a file-system fill up, and rather than telling me it was full it began arbitrarily overwriting old data while leaving the file access handles intact in the master file table (just testing it when I noticed it I made it think it had 245% capacity full). This made the files all *look* like they were still there, but the data inside them was completely gone/useless.

I imagine this is what the person with the 8GB card is experiencing and he just has not looked at *all* his data in depth to notice it happening, but if he ever tries to back up all the data to a PC it will start throwing a giant fit. I.E. every time he goes over 50% capacity he is destroying his files because the master file system thinks it is still safe to add files, while the hardware cannot do it, overwriting old bits.

Lets pretend for a moment that I have an 8GB card in my i730 that actually shows up. We'll say I have 3.99GB of data on it, and I try to write a file that is 0.011 GB to the data, thinking I have 4.01GB left.

If file "detroit-map" goes from point 1 to 2236 and the hardware hits a point where it can't access anything else (it will write 4,183,818,240-4,294,967,296 and reach a hardware limit) , it may just start over at the beginning again, writing the next file from point 1 to 432. This would mean that the first 432 bits on your card are from a different file, so the new file will read back fine, but detroit-map will now be a useless jumble of unrelated data.

Haha yea I meant NTFS. I just finished a brush up class in 3D Animation/Modeling, and had that in my head from there. US format for tv and the like. I was going to go back and edit it as I believed I typed it wrong, but I needed some sleep. Besides I figured you'd know what I was talking about. I found a formatter from HP that could format it to NTFS and did it with compression, but it wont format it to FAT (FAT16) as it says it's too big like with XPs formatter via command prompt. Do you know of a third party partitioner that would do it? I've tried Norton, Acronis, SwissKnife, and Powerquest, and the F: drive either doesn't come up, or it will only format to FAT32 w no options for partitioning. I also don't know how to use the programs much anyways.

I know that dood that makes Mem4 makes an SD partitioner but I don't want to order from him again. I actually got Mem4 from him after a lot of grief, but I haven't tested it as to how well it works. Seems like it just scans what's on an SD card and compresses it.

What I really want to do is try to partition the 8GB SD Card into two 4 GB SD partitions like you stated. That way I wouldn't need to buy another 4GB SD Card, and wouldn't need to switch cards to get it working. I realize you said it s the SDHC thing thats a problem, but the thing I don't get about it, is how I read online how people who have no SDHC support on their devices, whether ppc or cameras can get some SDHC cards to work.

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I've seen people messing around with the kernel to get their non SDHC cards, like i some cases formatting it, in other cases patch it, to get it to work in their camera and other devices, is this what you mean? Are you saying that if you changed the hardware access size of the SD Card it would BY NECESSITY run into the problem of overwriting previous data when it reached its 50% mark? Or it's a probability it MAY over write older data? Thanks for the post btw. I haven't heard this before.

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What I am saying is that as things are right now the hardware MUST overwrite old data to continue if the hardware is, in fact, within SD1.0 compliance. The fact that it lets him at all is likely a firmware bug, but a bug won't allow real usage of anything over 4GB, it will just pull the overwriting files crap and then tell you it's not really doing that.

I guarantee that the person with the "working" card is having this problem and just doesn't realize it yet.

The only alternative explanation is that someone, somewhere, decided to make 8GB standard SD cards with 2byte allocation and is selling them without any branding on them anywhere. Note in the pictures how it uses the SD trademark, not the SDHC mark. Look here SD Association The cards that guy is selling are not only non-compliant but most likely rather buggy, which would explain the fluke of it "working" at all.

Now, that aside, this is a hardware problem, not a software, so it can't be fixed like it is with cameras.

Cameras have software upgradeable firmware in their SD readers, the i730 does not (hence why the samsung people say it is a hardware issue rather than a firmware problem)

To make this work correctly you will have to rewrite the firmware in the SD reader itself, requiring you to burn a new ROM chip for it to use and solder the new one into place. That is assuming they are in fact pin compatible.

If you were willing to go through that trouble, it would in fact be easier to find a pin compatible SDHC reader and swap with the SD in the device already there... and just rip the driver for the new reader from whatever device you take it out of.

In any case, I want anyone who purchased a non-working SDHC card to try something for me. Repartition the card on your computer so that there is just one partition, and make the partition 3.72GB in size. 3.72GB exactly. Format the new partition, then try it again to see if it works in the i730 slot. This will possibly say whether the hardware itself is capable of reading an SDHC card at all (though it will most likely still fail due to overall drive size being registered).

The way that companies market their material is that most mean 4 billion bytes when they write 4 gigabytes, which is a vastly different number. 4 biillion bytes (4,000,000,000 bytes) is only 3.72 GB, whereas a true 4GB card would be 4,294,967,296 bytes (hard drive companies do this all the time, selling 187 GB drives with the label "200GB"... which means for every 500GB of drive you actually lose ~32GB, the bastards)

Now then, you mention people hacking kernels and firmware to use SDHC cards in non-HC slots, can you show me to one of those projects so that I don't have to spend the time looking? (I am, at the moment, trying to see how hard it would be to make a Windows CE 6 image for my phone, so I don't feel like googling around while I'm working on this)