You may have hit on something here. "modern technological marvels", "if only to hold the product in our hands right now", "Mac/Linux"...

I was involved in the "commercialization" of Unix. When it went from a lab tool for geeks to an OS for business. We had a proprietary OS as well. With the proprietary OS we supported backward compatibility (about 2 or 3 years backwards), graceful upgrades and patches. With the Unix OS we didn't do patches. It was pretty much "wait 3 months for the next release and do a wholesale upgrade". That was acceptable then. I believe you and Ananda should wait for, and only use mainstream, matured products and technology. Especially for mission critical applications. This (or any smartphone) is not them. Bleeding edge products and technology are not for you and I think your expectations unreasonable. As to expectations based on the price... In a couple of years the comparable product will cost less than half as much and be solid as a rock. But you knew that too?

-Quick

I think Quick hit it. I'm an "early adapter". Builit Heath kits in the late '70's, had a TRS 80 model 1, level 1 with 4k memory (and was astounded when I upgraded to 16k with a 300 baud modem). Even had a Commodore PET (I bet that's worth some money now if I hadn't deep 6'd it). Yes, its a bear being an unpaid beta tester, but I wouldn't have it any other way. (I feel that most here are quite the same in this respect).

I would hope that people looking for new technology would look into it prior to purchacing it. I went into this phone knowing it had some issues. Did anyone here not read or research the phone prior to purchace?

If so I really do feel sorry for you, getting into a buggy piece of hardware, but the same happens with any new technology (those Heath kits, TRS 80, ect....)

Perhaps Verizon and Kyo should refer people to this site prior to sale of the phone and make ya' sign an agreement that you read and understand that you may get screaming mad, but will have only one item on your belt instead of a beeper, phone, and pda...

I'm thrilled with my 7135, use it multiple hours each day, carry an extra battery, use Crash and backup to my SD card and have lost no data since using backing up (I use CardBackup from jkware.com which no one else here seems to use, but the guy who wrote it has a 7135 and tests things on his...).

Like most here, my time is very valuable dollar wise, and I make up more time than I loose using one device that gives me access to most of my medical texts, antibiotic guides, current treatment algorhythms, ect., as I don't have the expert backup here in rural Tennessee.

Bottom line: early adapter = grief, headaches, fun......

__________________
Here, have a clue. No, take two, they're small.....

I didn't have any qualms with the Heath kits, as well. They were what they were-an interesting hobby for the D-I-Y type. I would love this phone if it came out as a Heath kit; but it would also probably cost alot less because of its "kit" status and I could look you in the eye and keep a straight face when I say "sure, it has a few quirks, but...."

But it isn't. It is supposedly a "finished" piece of somewhat high technology, supposedly ready for primetime. If it had the word "Heath" across the box I would be more forgiving of its lack of reliability. If I wanted to be a Q/C guy, I'd get a job at Kyocera. Then, at least I could get paid to have problems with my equipment.

And If I'm such an "early adapter" why was my 6035 not 10 times worse in terms of reliability vs. the 7135? That phone (6035) was 20 times better. Why is it that all of my business aquaintences who had a 6035 and "upgraded" to a 7135 (6 of them) have had to get at least 1 replacement? One of them got pissed off and gave up after 4 attempts (at the "bleeding edge", if you will) and switched to Sprint and one of their "boring" smartphones.

Look, I'm just as nuts about technology as the next guy. Every room in my house has been wired for ethernet for years, I control every remote in the house (including lights and the thermostat) with my Phillips Pronto (before they were offering them "pre-programmed" for $600 more), Linux PVR, you know, soup to nuts. I like fiddling with stuff. Just not while I'm working. I guess I expected too much from the makers of the 6035.

__________________
"plus ca change, plus c’est la meme chose"

I think that by now we all understand that you are not really that happy with your 7135. But this seems to bias you against those that do like what they got for their money. Perhaps you should clarify that you are only looking for the negative stories because of your investment in Sprint/Handspring stock?

So, as a journalist, please tell us who you are and where we can read some of your work.

..."i can't be on a call with a presidential candidate or head of some company and have my phone cut out in the middle of a newspaper interview"...GIVE ME A BREAK!!!!!!!!!!!!!:eyes1

I can't be on a call with a presidential candidate or head of some company and have my phone cut out in the middle either! Isn't that a crazy coincidence?

I normally lurk on this forum, but this has made me get off the sidelines.

First off, like e dub, I own my own business, and I bought the 7135 specifically to replace my old combination of a Motorola T720 and Palm Vx. The T720 now does duty as my personal phone, and I take it with me when I am not "on-call", so to speak.

I am quite satisfied with the switch, and I don't think I would ever go back to a separate palm/phone setup. Yes, the phone has crashed on me before, but it actually crashes far less often than my Palm V did on its own with the same load of applications. It isn't all that fragile either - my business centers around working on race cars and tuning engine management systems, and the phone regularly sees hostile environments, up to and including sitting right on top of (very hot) engine intake manifolds and displaying real-time engine diagnostic data, while the engine is running! I've dropped it more times than I would like to admit to, and while the case is a little chipped in places, it just keeps on ticking -- I have yet to lose a call after dropping it or having it fall off the roof of a car (ouch).

There are plenty of us out there using the phone for its advertised purpose who like it. Because we like it, we have nothing to say about it -- I have never needed to post on this bulletin board because I haven't had a problem. Whether that is because I have good karma or sacrifice small animals to the Kyocera gods every night, I don't know (at least I don't do the small animals thing, that's for sure), but I certainly wouldn't rely on the reports from a handful of users (and 100-200 users is definitely a handful, given how many of these phones are out there) as a statistically valid sample.

Yep, the 7135 software was and is still faulty. Anyone who buys this thing and is not ready to account for that fact, needs to exercise the return policy. The thing is this --- the 7135 is still the only smartphone on VZW that has all of the features I want. Here is a better analogy. I prefer a man who is over 6' tall but if a man is 5'9" with all of the other attributes important to me, well, I'll hang with a "shorty".

I've "stabilized" my 7135 with the right combo of software. I carry an extra battery when I'm traveling (not near my office or my own car). I back my phone up daily and often right after adding a lot of new data (syncing with my company Notes calendar, adding company addresses in bulk, etc.)

These things irk me:

• I have do all of this extra work because the battery life sucks.
• I had to dump, upgrade, change software that works just fine on my other Palm OS devices.
• I had to exchange my phone a few times since January to get a phone that was not defective.
• I must do frequent backups.

Now that I'm making all of these adjustments, I'm loving and wearing the heck out of this thing. It is my modem for decent speeds and no extra cost at night and weekends. It is my pager, my bible, my calorie counter, my TV guide and my phone. Best of all, it looks like a phone (although a little too big). I'm spoiled with all of these features in one package and won't go back. Instead, I'm putting up with the things that still irk me -- for a while.

When my VZW contract nears expiration (which will be after Number Portability) and a slimmer, faster, and more stable smartphone is introduced with all of the positive features which the 7135 has (speakerphone, expansion card, clamshell design), my phone will find a home in a shelter with many of my other phones. I only hope the new smarphone will have more stable firmware.

Additional note: The phone side of my device has never been a problem. Even when it crashes my conversations continue uninterrupted.

Ananda, it is nice to see you are doing your research on the 7135 with an open mind.

Your last post started with "i posted on this site to gather horror stories on the 7135 and so far, i have only gotten two (one being yours)." This is a definite indicator you are determined to smear the 7135 because you don't have the time to address the required learning curve.

Your "I'm too busy" attitude is a common thread among those who are disparaging technology that they cannot bend to their will simply because they don't have time to learn how to use it. Those who are willing to invest the time get significant benefit from the 7135.

My guess is you were also too busy to do much research on the 7135 before you bought it. If you had you would have found out there was not much out there about the 7135 other than a few computer magazines articles which either gushed about the phone or included blatantly incorrect information about the phone which seemed slanted to trashing the phone without putting the phone through its paces before hand, just like you seem to be willing to do now.

Based on the information available at the time I purchased the phone, I knew the 7135 was a first generation product of it's platform type. No other company had marketed a 16 meg clamshell with a MMC/SD expansion card slot running on the Palm OS running on a CDMA 2000 1X tri-mode (800/1900 + AMPS) capable network with an astounding list of features never seen before in this form factor.

First one, never been done before, might not be perfect, on the bleeding edge of consumer technology...those are all things that came to my mind as I checked out the 7135 before I plunked down my 500 bucks.

Maybe I'm getting old and cranky, but I find it hard to work up much sympathy for someone who could have found out the same things I did before making the purchase, did not, and now wants to trash the product because "I don't have enough time."

You did buy the wrong phone. It will not work for you. You will always be unhappy with it. You will find a few with whom to share your dissatisfaction. You will not learn what an amazing device it is because you will not invest the time. You want instant gratification because you spent $500 bucks on something about which you did not know enough.

IMHO you are misplacing your aggravation. You should be aggravated with yourself, maybe even with that nasty salesman that sold you something you can't make work because you are to busy.

You are absolutely correct Kyocera released the 7135 before it was perfect, but in the real world where I live, that is a fact of life. Being profit driven one tries to sell ones product while there is a demand. If Kyocera, or any other manufacturer, waited until their product was perfect for every potential customer we would all still be reading scrolls by candle light.

Someone has to be among the first to purchase a new product and quite often being first means getting the early bugs that are worked out over the commercial lifespan of a product.

One thing I have learned is never buy the first generation of a new vehicle model. Don't do it. That first year model is when the design flaws will be discovered. The third or fourth year of a model design is when to buy vehicle. After the first and second generation of buyers have discovered the bugs and the manufacturer has fixed them.

That is the real world. Your whining infers that Kyocera is selling crap to the unwashed masses which is simply not the case. For those who did their homework, understood what they were buying and were willing to invest the time to get what they needed from the phone Kyocera is selling one cool product.

I have owned seven Palm products and more cell phones and pagers then I can count. For the past five years I have hoped for a device that would combine the capabilities of the phone and Palm so I would not have to carry both. For the past four years I have used a connector cable to link the two together so I could access e-mail and the Internet while sitting in various airports around the country. When I first tried to get the two devices to work together the results were not satisfactory, but it finally worked pretty well ONCE I INVESTED THE TIME TO FIGURE IT OUT.

Ananda, it is a shame that as a newbie you come to this forum to gather dirt on a pretty good product, rather than spending a little time in browsing posts of interest to find what may be helpful to you. You obviously became a forum member with the desire to trash the phone rather than learning from the combined experiences of the hundreds, if not thousands, of satisfied users.

While I'm at it, I don't own any Kyocera stock. I don't own any Verizon stock. I don't work for either. I do know how to research a product before I buy it. I do understand the risks one takes if one buys the first generation of any product. I do not expect anything I buy to work like I want it to if I am not willing to invest the time to learn how to use it. And lastly, I don't bitch and moan about how unfair a company is because they did not wait until their product was perfect for me before they sold it.

If you have problems with the 7135 take it up with Kyocera and your service provider. Don't come to this forum bottom feeding for the very small minority who are shocked they are having issues with a very sophisticated consumer electronic device. You have blatantly insulted the overwhelming majority of us who are satisfied with this phone by inferring we have some ulterior motive for being positive about the phone and our experiences with it.

I most sincerely apologize to the loyal members of this forum for this tirade. If you have read my previous posts you know I have tried to be positive and fair in my posts. I especially apologize to those who do have issues with the 7135 and have so stated their opinions and concerns on this forum. This is not a rant against anyone with whom I do not agree or who is critical of the 7135. This is absolutely the place to express the deficiencies of the 7135 and the associated support services. I too have been critical of the phone, Kyocera and my service carrier at times. What yanked my chain is Anandas insistence that those of us who like the phone are shills for corporate America and Kyocera is shafting it's customer by marketing a flawed product, as if the flaws outweigh the benefits.

There, now I have had my say. I am finished with this thread and hope Ananda will find some other forum on which to do his "journalistic research." He is an affront to the purpose of this forum.

Bill Cottun

__________________
bcottun

Rats, and here I am only 5' 8"

Well, I am also happily married too :angel2

The i500 looked like a "better" PDA/phone, except is was on Sprint only and no speaker phone or card slot. I have only had my 7135 a couple of weeks and I have already used the speaker phone several times - I was surprised how handy it is.

I love the Verizon coverage - it is the best in my area, but I wish the 7135 was as small and light as the i500. Of course my old eyes don't see the smaller screen as well either. I read threads over on the i500 board and they have troubles too.

I guess there is no such thing as a perfect phone/PDA (yet) and the more a power user you are the more trouble you will have. The earlier you adopt the new device the more trouble you will have - heck even my T720 was replaced because I had one of the early ones.

Dennis

I think I would still look at getting a 3rd phone AND get your power cords replaced as well.

I burned up a Startac using a car cord a few years back. I was on a really long call (while I was driving) and the phone was hot from the use - then the phone went "deaf", you had to be right next to a tower to make a call. It was replaced (free) and then I noticed the car cord smelled burnt too, so Verizon gave me a new one (also for free).

If you are going to be on really long calls, if there is anything wrong with the charger or car cord that could be your problem. Get an extra battery an only makes calls on the batteries would be another thought.

Dennis

I bought a 7135 on Jan 6 2003 about two weeks after the Alltel release. By August I had been through three 7135's - the last two from Verizon. The first one stopped locking onto a signal and otherwise I was happy with it with few crashes, the second one kept going to a black screen of death and losing data after a few weeks of use, and the third just crashed a lot and I sold it.

I also became tired of the poor battery life as a phone, the crashes, and data loses, being paraoid and backing up 3-4x a day. My Kyocera 6035 was a much better phone, but I wanted the color screen and MP3 player, SD card slot and 1xRTT data speed, so I made the jump to a 7135 and regretted it.

I could talk on the phone for 5 hours a day on my 6035 before killing the battery, it could standby for 6 days without a charge if I didn't use it much. My typical average usage each day was 30-40 minutes a day of phone calls, and 2hours a day pf PDA use with checking email 4-5x a day and it lasted 3 days between charges.

With the addition of Jack Sprat/Jack Flash software, I was able to delete enough files from ROM and free up enough space in the ROM to store snapper mail, Blazer browser, a couple of games/utilities, and a backup of my contacts/calandar and todo list to the built in Flash memory! I was able to run hacks and games and quickoffice with no problems. Instead of 1-2 crashes a day I would see 1 crash a week, none with data loss.

I am now usiing a Palm Tungsten T3 and a Sony Erricsson T616 bluetooth phone to get the same functionality (email, surfing, palm and phone). Because of iSync on my new Mac I can sync the T616 and use it as a mini PDA when I don't want to carry the T3 (I also dumped my Viewsonic and then my Toshiba tablet PC 6 weeks ago ofr a 1ghz G4 Mac powerbook 12" with bluetooth). The T616 phone battery lasts for days on end with using for incoming calls to my business toll free number, and for blue tooth internet connectivity for my Palm and laptop. It is rated at 8 hours talk and 10 days standby, and even with 4 hours of data usage it stands by for at least 3-4 days. It isn't a problem for me to carry a 4oz palm and a 3oz phone for now, but I don't wear bikini tops.

Since Verizon has better voice coverage, I kept their service with a VX6000 camera phone, but plan to get another 6035 for my 3rd line with VZW as a spare. (We have 3 lines on a family share plan, 1 line for my wife, one for me, and one as a family phone).I can carry the VX6000 and T616 on my belt and the T3 in my front pocket.

So, that is my story and I'm sticking to it. Sorry guys, don't want to be a traitor, but I'd had it with crashing tablet PC's and data loss on my palm phone.

(PS: My coworker switched from a 6035 on sprint to a 7135 on Verizon and he has NO problems, but he runs very very little 3rd party software, and his 7135 doesn't have the latest firmware either, it is 3-4 months old. He isn't tech savy at all, wouldn't know what to do if his phone crashed, and would come to me to fix any problem he has, but has never needed to).

__________________
Larry Ganz
http://www.jesusreigns.org
John 3:16

I have had my 7135 since April 03, and still on my original phone. I had the 6035 before that (I wish I knew about SMS when I had it), and maybe its just me, but I have had more reliability with the 7135 with 3rd party software (and hacks) loaded than I did with my 6035 with NO 3rd party software. I went through 3 6035's.

Yes, I have had a few crashes, fatal exceptions, and so on, probably fewer than most...But never a hard reset and never any lost data. I guess my only real complaint is battery life. While it hasn't been a problem for me (I use less than 1000 minutes a month) even I see the need for more battery life, if I were to push my useage any higher.

As for software that should be included (like a backup utility). I guess Verizon/Kyocera/and Palm decided to just give us basic software included, and let us find the best programs for ourselves based on how we'll use it. Otherwise I guess It should have come with Bebopper, TakePhone, DateBook 5, and Backup Buddy VFS just to name a few.

As for trying to find horror stories here...You'll find a few, but this site is mainly for people who are fans of the phone, most people who were not happy with the phone have gone to something else and therefor wont frequent or even visit this forum anymore. Why would they?

__________________
Billman
Colorado
__________________

Did I say that, or just think it?

Well, I guess after reading to this string you may never want to look a 7135 in its colorful display again. On the other hand you now may want two of them. While I'm not typically one who gets all burnt up "when technology attacks" on occasion I take exception this time. Here's why. As we can see from some of the replies in this string, quite a few of us know quite a few others who have had to replace this phone, often on more than one occasion, especially under heavy use for business, diagnostics, etc.

As we all know, any product can come out the box defective. Hell, a few years ago BMW had to give me my money back for an M5 that was an out-right lemon. I had a Fiat that was more reliable. But I know it was a fluke because I've owned 4 BMWs previously (even back into the 80's, when all of that "bleeding edge-technology" was really tempermental) and I belong to a national BMW club where (much like this user's forum) you can find alot out, both good and bad. My car was a fluke, plain and simple. But I think that it's safe to say that after reading all of the replies here we are not just dealing with a one-time fluke, or "user error" as many of our more technology savvy neighbors are often all to quick to use in times of technical distress, if you will. Flat out, while the 7135 has tons of potential it just wasn't ready for release when it was. While I can get upset with Kyocera most of my anger is directed at Verizon product development for not doing their job in the first place, and the Verizon bean counters who perhaps did not let them, in fear of losing sales to the next newest thing on the block brought out by Sprint or whomever.

This morning was the last straw for me. I took off all of my 3rd party software and started fresh (again). I did this a few days ago after I got the software upgrade, but even I can be a wild-eyed optimist at times. Hard reset, totally clean, no programs added to the ones that came with the phone. I went out to the store, it crashed three (3) times in 15 minutes, all while attempting to use the voice side-no fancy browser shennanigans involved. After 30 minutes on the phone with C/S and their only solution being to give me half off a $200 phone that has no PDA functions I'm off to sprint at the end of the month (so I can keep my #s). While I've had nothing but good things to say about verizon for the 5 years (at $200-$250/month) I've been with them, but I guess I never had to really use their C/S before this phone. I'll probably end up getting a Treo 600, as I have two close friends who have dealt with it in product development (one at Sprint and the other at Palm) and I've been beating up a pre-pro for my friend at sprint for a few months. I guess hindsight is 20/20; over 18 months ago my friend at Sprint said that they were not going to carry the 7135 because it had a few too many wrinkles left to be ironed out. But I had figured by the time Verizon released it all those "wrinkles" would be ironed. So much for that Idea.

For all of you happy 7135 users out there I wish you God-speed and continued good luck with your purchase. For all those such as myself who are through with this tulmultuous love affair, I suggest taking it to Verizon by denying them your hard-earned $$$'s and take your business elsewhere.

Cheers,

Dennis

__________________
"plus ca change, plus c’est la meme chose"

"Flat out... wasn't ready for release". Again, sorry that I missed the substantiative basis for this claim. Please note that I'm not saying you are wrong.

-Quick (my appologies for getting a bit impatient, i may have to drop out of this thread)

Well, I'm on the verge of getting rid of my 7135 - been looking at other options recently.... Since the F/W upgrade too many resets, I now have the contrast shift (never had it before the upgrade) and I am sick of resetting my phone 10 - 30 times a day. I'm not goig to bother with even trying to get it replaced, I'm going to ask for another phone all together. I've been playing with a few of the Windows phones, people at work have them, and they seem solid. I thnk I'm just sick of Palm OS.

Contrast Shift
Missed Calls
Voice Mail alerts 2 days after VM is left
10-30 soft resets a day
5-10 Hard resets a week

__________________
Audio_Whore :)
6035-7135-Treo 650

Oh boy, here we go. I'm guessing that your panties are all in a bunch because not everyone out there is as pleased as punch with their 7135 as you are. If you are that troubled that this phone isn't the panacea that you perhaps expected it to be for every man, woman and child, and that yes, world hunger, racism and poverty will continue to flourish unfettered in its presence then you are more than welcome to purchase mine. Your cost: $1500. After all, if you are that enamored with its mystical powers and other-wordly abilities then I would think it worth at least that much to you, if only to preserve one for posterity.

__________________
"plus ca change, plus c’est la meme chose"